Dealing with NCAA 8 hour Rule during GPP

Posted In: What Would You Do?

      • Mike Young
        Keymaster
        Mike Young on #12114

        A timely "what would you do?"

        Athletes: A team of collegiate speed / power athletes (sprinters and / or jumpers).

        Scenario: You are setting up GPP training for your speed / power athletes. Unfortunately you are in the period of time where NCAA restrictions limit your training to 8 hours of supervised practice / week. To make things worse, your university won't let the athletes train using athletic department facilities or equipment (weight room, track, med balls, etc) without a coaches supervision.

        Things to consider:
        *What would you focus on (speed, strength, flexibility, etc)?
        *How would you alter your normal / ideal training scheme?
        *What methods would you use to maximize time efficiency?

        ELITETRACK Founder

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        utfootball4 on #55928

        i really would keep my overall plan the same, i would give the captain my warmup and cooldown program and let them warmup and cooldown so once i get to the track they are ready to workout. things to consider i may try and talk to my AD and see can we hire a work study student to supervise the weight room, if hes a good AD he will work with you as much as possible. Also like many coaches they go over the 8hr work limit maybe not much but 10-20min per week.

        Focus: General Fitness, Overall Strength Levels and Develop Acc mech.

        I would have to alter my training some for example I wont be able to give them as much rest as I may want etc.

        The seniors and captains will have a major role and will have to have strong leadership and be ready to work so everyone else can follow.

        mon: 30min weights/80min track
        hill work 10-40m
        low vol med ball throws
        clean and jerk
        back squats

        tue: 45mins
        tempos
        bb circuits

        wed: 30min weights/80min track
        low vol med ball acc
        flat acc work 10-40m
        power snatch
        front squats

        thur:45mins
        tempo
        bb circuits

        fri: 30min weights/80min track
        low vol med ball throws or jumps
        intensive tempo 1600m
        power clean
        back squats
        bench press

        OR

        make friday another hill workout and then make saturday a captain practice workout and have the captains lead a intensive tempo or ext tempo workout.

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        flight05 on #55929

        is this a new rule for this year?

        i know what we did last year was keep the sprints with short recovery to maximize time, stairs were done on our own time, the following day, and tempo workouts are fairly quick

        warmup/cooldowns were done on our own with our respective captains.

        i like the setup utfootball has there, we did the same thing basically except we dont have hills so it was stairs…

        we were also able to get some quick jumping in before the speed days but our wieghtroom i think was supervised by Grad assist.

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        Kebba Tolbert on #55930

        no comment  :dance:

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        Chad Williams on #55931

        I would go with a 4 day week, taking Wednesday Off but encouring they play basketball or some sort of recreational sport.   

        Monday – Hurdle walks, Weights with high volume/ low intensity multi throws + acc + core (2)
        Tuesday –  Intensive Tempo runs + plyo circuit + Barefoot walks + core (1.5)
        Wed – Off (Basketball or some other sport encouraged)
        Thursday – Hurdle walks, Weights with low volume/high intensity multi throws + hills + core (2)
        Friday –  Extensive Tempo runs + very light plyo circuit + Barefoot walks + core (1.5)

        As much as I would like to leave warming up and cooling down to the older athletes, I would rather take more time in the beginning with 4 days with them myself than leave them on their own.  I believe the GPP is vital to establishing proper warm-up, practice and cooling down procedures which set the tone for the rest of the year.  Also, I would hate to leave anything unsupervised during these early stages (weightroom esp) for fear of improper technique development. 

        Furthermore time efficiency is far less important than establishing a solid routine.  Exercises and technique are often repeated in the early stages to reiterate proper form and with the four day week, it leaves some time to play around with when early practices run long.

             
         

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        utfootball4 on #55932

        I would go with a 4 day week, taking Wednesday Off but encouring they play basketball or some sort of recreational sport.   

        Monday – Hurdle walks, Weights with high volume/ low intensity multi throws + acc + core (2)
        Tuesday –  Intensive Tempo runs + plyo circuit + Barefoot walks + core (1.5)
        Wed – Off (Basketball or some other sport encouraged)
        Thursday – Hurdle walks, Weights with low volume/high intensity multi throws + hills + core (2)
        Friday –  Extensive Tempo runs + very light plyo circuit + Barefoot walks + core (1.5)

        As much as I would like to leave warming up and cooling down to the older athletes, I would rather take more time in the beginning with 4 days with them myself than leave them on their own.  I believe the GPP is vital to establishing proper warm-up, practice and cooling down procedures which set the tone for the rest of the year.  Also, I would hate to leave anything unsupervised during these early stages (weightroom esp) for fear of improper technique development. 

        Furthermore time efficiency is far less important than establishing a solid routine.  Exercises and technique are often repeated in the early stages to reiterate proper form and with the four day week, it leaves some time to play around with when early practices run long.

             
         

        just curious why bb on wed i could see maybe during summer or with high school girls, but at the college level LETS RUN AND SAVE GAMES FOR ANOTHER TIME.

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        Daniel Andrews on #55933

        Because too much focus on running/sprinting makes you stale.  It's GPP, not the competitive season.

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        track400 on #55934

        damimal- this is exactly the topic we spent time on in my level one course.  in an off season that we should develop more systems other than the ones we do during the season.  ex.  playing basketball, soccer all year around, the body needs to work more systems if it wants to see improvement in the other sports.  we talked in length about this in our physiology (and some bio-motor) discussion.  i know this is more for younger athletes, but our instructor still thought it was important that doing other activites that athletes like was important for development.

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        utfootball4 on #55935

        Because too much focus on running/sprinting makes you stale.  It's GPP, not the competitive season.

        i disagree, i would do a 20min run before i let my athletes play basketball.  so let say if one of your best sprinters blow a Achilles tendon?

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        pzale8018 on #55936

        I too am a proponent of a 4 day work week.  Most likely, your athletes didn't do as much off season work as you would have liked and they may not be in the kind of shape you'd like them to be in.  They will probably respond pretty well to having that extra day off.  Use the 4 days to get the work done you need to do.  If they seem able to handle more, have the seniors call practice one day a week and have that be a recovery/tempo day. 

        [quote author="danimal9" date="1155708424"]
        Because too much focus on running/sprinting makes you stale.  It's GPP, not the competitive season.

        i disagree, i would do a 20min run before i let my athletes play basketball.  so let say if one of your best sprinters blow a Achilles tendon?
        [/quote]

        I'm with danimal on this one.  While I would never put too much focus on games, I think a mental break from the track is a useful tool to keeping the kids excited, motivated, and wanting to come back.  Maybe basketball isn't a good choice of activities, due to the high risk of injury, but you have that risk with any activity you do.  Giving the kids a break mentally can go a long way to making it a more successful season by year's end.

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        utfootball4 on #55937

        I too am a proponent of a 4 day work week.  Most likely, your athletes didn't do as much off season work as you would have liked and they may not be in the kind of shape you'd like them to be in.  They will probably respond pretty well to having that extra day off.  Use the 4 days to get the work done you need to do.  If they seem able to handle more, have the seniors call practice one day a week and have that be a recovery/tempo day. 

        [quote author="utfootball4" date="1155735540"]
        [quote author="danimal9" date="1155708424"]
        Because too much focus on running/sprinting makes you stale.  It's GPP, not the competitive season.

        i disagree, i would do a 20min run before i let my athletes play basketball.  so let say if one of your best sprinters blow a Achilles tendon?
        [/quote]

        I'm with danimal on this one.  While I would never put too much focus on games, I think a mental break from the track is a useful tool to keeping the kids excited, motivated, and wanting to come back.  Maybe basketball isn't a good choice of activities, due to the high risk of injury, but you have that risk with any activity you do.  Giving the kids a break mentally can go a long way to making it a more successful season by year's end.
        [/quote]

        im a believer in how vince anderson run things, he give his sprinters a 6 day a week program in the summer and let them know that if they dont report back in shape and ready to go then we will have problems – not good. bc come sept we are rolling! his summer program is as follows:

        mon: 100m sprints 12-13sec

        tue: 6×300 continuous 60sec

        wed: med ball circuit

        thur: 4×200 27 or 6×50 6sec

        fri: Grass Circuit

        sat: Activity hour walk, hoops, swim, bike, aerobics

        COME SEPT LETS ROLL, NO NEED FOR ALL THAT BB CRAP IN THE FALL!

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        Chad Williams on #55938

        I would be interested to see how PZale or Danimal would set up your 4 day week opposed to what I have already set up.       

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        pzale8018 on #55939

        Alright…

        for quartermilers in an ends to the middle type program, it might look something like this early on in gpp…

        Monday:  Acceleration work, High intensity weights
        Tuesday:  Intensive tempo (ex:  10x200m males in 32, females in 36)
        Weds:  Off (Captain's practice, Extensive tempo or some other activity)
        Thursday:  Elastic power exercies (plyos, bounding, maybe some accel)
        Friday:  Intensive tempo
        Weekends off

        Please keep in mind that his is a proposed schedule for the beginning parts of gpp.  Once the NCAA clears you to go as often as you'd like, you move to 5 and maybe 6 days a week.  Obviously short sprinters wouldn't do nearly as much intensive tempo, if any at all.

        Like I said before, mental breaks from the grind are more important than some people think.  You can get a great deal of high quality work done even when giving the kids a little time off.  You'd be surprised at the effects.

      • Mike Young
        Keymaster
        Mike Young on #55940

        Wow….this one's getting good. Right now, I'm going 6 days a week with some days being as short as 50 minutes a day and others lasting up to 2 hours. I have the benefit of having my athletes have to do lots of general work as part of their school / military training….all cadets take a PE classes, PT, etc. I also have the benefit of my athletes coming in with good fitness levels. During summer they are having to do morning PT for the Army. While this stuff is by no means ideal (long distance runs, 12 mile ruck marches, calistenics, etc) it at least ensures that no one is out of shape. If anything they come highly overtrained.

        While we're not doing running workouts every day I actually wouldn't want them to be playing basketball….I gave them all summer (6-8 weeks) to do that type of thing. While the work is very general in nature at this point it's all geared towards where I want them in 3 months.

        ELITETRACK Founder

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        utfootball4 on #55941

        Wow….this one's getting good. Right now, I'm going 6 days a week with some days being as short as 50 minutes a day and others lasting up to 2 hours. I have the benefit of having my athletes have to do lots of general work as part of their school / military training….all cadets take a PE classes, PT, etc. I also have the benefit of my athletes coming in with good fitness levels. During summer they are having to do morning PT for the Army. While this stuff is by no means ideal (long distance runs, 12 mile ruck marches, calistenics, etc) it at least ensures that no one is out of shape. If anything they come highly overtrained.

        While we're not doing running workouts every day I actually wouldn't want them to be playing basketball….I gave them all summer (6-8 weeks) to do that type of thing. While the work is very general in nature at this point it's all geared towards where I want them in 3 months.

        thanks a lot Mike for reforcing my point, i dont mind them playing games once a week in the summer but come fall lets work.

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        flight05 on #55942

        so is there a point of even going thru a gpp when ppl come in that good in shape? do u start sprinting/plyos right away with them?

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        mn-highjumper on #55943

        We have this time restraint right now, so here's our WOMEN'S schedule:

        4 day track week (friday's optional but 'strongly recommended)

        Mon-Thursday lifting, 45 minutes to 1 hour
        Monday and Wednesday are tempo days,
        Tuesday and Thursday are short sprint days.

        Jumpers and multi are only doing jumping components on Tuesdays and Thursdays for the next two weeks to focus somewhat more on building speed.

        An example of our typical gpp week :
        Monday, lift at 6:30 am, 10×200 at 38 with 30 seconds between each (this started at 6 and built up to 10)
        Tuesday, lift at 6:30, 2x4x30 incline sprints, 4×20 flat sprints
        Wednesday, lift at 6:30, 2×500 with 15 minutes between; last 100m in 20 seconds
        Thursday, lift at 6:30, I can't remember although I believe it is sleds…
        Friday, optional, no lift, 2x5x100 at 85%

      • Mike Young
        Keymaster
        Mike Young on #55944

        so is there a point of even going thru a gpp when ppl come in that good in shape? do u start sprinting/plyos right away with them?

        The fitness levels I get them at is nothing related to speed-power development. While I know they've been active over summer I can pretty much guarantee that most of them couldn't do anything speed-power related for almost 2 months. In fact, they've probably done all endurance-type activities. Regardless though, I'd still have my sprinters doing speed-power work right off the bat. Short accelerations, low level plyos, multi-throws, etc. These can be incorporated with little regard to the fitness level as long as the dosage is appropriate within the context of the overall training scheme. For example we might do sprints as short as 5-10m the first cycle. I'd do this whether they were 'in shape' or not.

        ELITETRACK Founder

      • Mike Young
        Keymaster
        Mike Young on #55945

        We have this time restraint right now, so here's our WOMEN'S schedule:

        4 day track week (friday's optional but 'strongly recommended)

        Mon-Thursday lifting, 45 minutes to 1 hour
        Monday and Wednesday are tempo days,
        Tuesday and Thursday are short sprint days.

        Jumpers and multi are only doing jumping components on Tuesdays and Thursdays for the next two weeks to focus somewhat more on building speed.

        An example of our typical gpp week :
        Monday, lift at 6:30 am, 10×200 at 38 with 30 seconds between each (this started at 6 and built up to 10)
        Tuesday, lift at 6:30, 2x4x30 incline sprints, 4×20 flat sprints
        Wednesday, lift at 6:30, 2×500 with 15 minutes between; last 100m in 20 seconds
        Thursday, lift at 6:30, I can't remember although I believe it is sleds…
        Friday, optional, no lift, 2x5x100 at 85%

        The only problem I really see with that setup is that athletes could potentially go 3 consecutive days without training. I'd much rather see the optional day on Wednesday and then have mandatory practice on Thursday and Friday. Also, seems like a lot of tempo work for jumpers but it could work depending on how the remainder of the year's training is set up.

        ELITETRACK Founder

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        utfootball4 on #55946

        i agree too much tempo and dont understand why they are doing tempo before speed.

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